Ozark
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Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 4012
Loc: out in the woods
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If somebody could just clean up the abuse and overbilling in the medical field, that would help a lot.
When our youngest daughter was a teenager, she had to have her tonsils out. It was a day surgery, and we sat with her in the hospital all day.
They let her go home in the late afternoon, and in gathering up her stuff one of the nurses handed me a plastic bag. It contained a new plastic toothbrush, a little tiny tube of toothpaste, a little sample bottle of Scope mouthwash, and a little sample bottle of Tylenol - maybe $4 worth of stuff at WalMart, if they sold containers that small.
The nurse said "She can take this home with her", and like a dummy I said, "Uh, OK" and took it. When we got the bill, the hospital charged $68.50 extra for that bag!
Another daughter is a surgical tech. She says there's a sealed plastic kit in every emergency room that contains tools and dressings for some particular kind of medical situation, I forgot what. The kit is seldom used, and they go six months or so without opening one. Thing is - EVERY emergency room patient is charged for the use of one of those kits - $150 bucks extra, because it's available.
And like I mentioned before, that ambulance company recently DOUBLED the charge for my Mom's ambulance ride as soon as they found out it was covered by the government and insurance.
There's so much abuse going on - it needs cleaning up.
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Hellbender
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 3416
Loc: Taney County
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Well Ozark all i can say is that you have bad luck, my wife is an RN, and has done most of her career in the ER, OF, and IC, and thats not normal.
I'll tell you what, you turn that portfolio with Exxon and all those other premo stocks of your, any retirement IRA's, etc over to the feds for a year. If you still think they can do a stand up job on things, I'll consider putting my health care in their hands.
In the mean time I'll stick with what I've seen work for many years, if you want the best performance, put it in a competitive market where a profit is a stake.
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A government survey has shown that 91% of illegal immigrants come to this country so that they can see their own doctor.
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Ozark
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 4012
Loc: out in the woods
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Quote:
Hellbender said:
if you want the best performance, put it in a competitive market where a profit is a stake.
I agree completely, and that's why government needs to get OUT of health care and not farther into it.
Any provider is going to charge what the market will bear - and when it comes to the deep pockets of the government and insurance companies, that's a lot. If people had to pay for their own medical care, then charges would have to come down to what they could pay.
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Hellbender
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 3416
Loc: Taney County
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Let me shock the chit out of everybody, they should just extend Medicare to everyone, with some adjustments.
Everyone goes on Medicare and you pay for it through deductions for SS, if you want a part "B", with extended coverage, you pay more and its deducted from your pay,if you want "B" with a supplement thats OK also, you pay for what you get. If you opt for private insurance you have a bye on Medicare, but if you lose it Medicare kicks in automatically.
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A government survey has shown that 91% of illegal immigrants come to this country so that they can see their own doctor.
Edited by Hellbender (09/20/07 01:34 PM)
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Ozark
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 4012
Loc: out in the woods
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Quote:
Hellbender said:
they should just extend Medicare to everyone
And doctors will get a raise from $1000 a day to $1000 an hour. Every other cost connected with medicine would go 'way up too.
Why not - tax money pays for it, and if that doesn't cover it all the government can just run a bigger deficit.
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Whackattack
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 2554
Loc: Farmington, Mo
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Quote:
Hellbender said:
Let me shock the chit out of everybody, they should just extend Medicare to everyone, with some adjustments.
Everyone goes on Medicare and you pay for it through deductions for SS, if you want a part "B", with extended coverage, you pay more and its deducted from your pay,if you want "B" with a supplement thats OK also, you pay for what you get. If you opt for private insurance you have a bye on Medicare, but if you lose it Medicare kicks in automatically.
Uh....NO!!! Medicare serves a very, very samll segment of our society right now. Expand that to 300 million and it will get ugly quick. It is also in dire financial straights. Medicare is so underfunded that the s..t is gonna hit the fan for Medicare long before it does for SS. Ozark's got it right. Get the government out of the forking social programs not put them into more.
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Ozark
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 4012
Loc: out in the woods
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Another little story about how much "padding" I think goes into medical charges:
A friend of mine is a veterinarian. I saw him one evening and he said he was tired, he'd been spaying dogs all afternoon. He did about 12 dogs at $75 bucks a pop, so he said he made good money that day.
I poured him a beer and asked him if that wasn't the same operation as when a woman gets "fixed". He said, yep - it's the same thing.
"How much", I asked, "do they charge human patients for that operation?"
He said "Oh, about $3500 or so. Those MD's and hospitals have really got it made".
"Did ya ever have a dog die, because of that operation?"
"Nope. In fact, humans would be easier to do. Big dogs are easy. It's the little dogs that are hard to operate on because everything is so small. And hey - a lot of womens' bellies aren't as hairy as the dogs' bellies."
From there, the conversation kinda deteriorated into beer drinking.
Now, I'm not saying that humans should get the same level of medical care as animals. But the point is - if a guy can make real good money doing that operation (with 100% safety) for $75, well, $3500 is sure a helluva lot more money for the same job.
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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"Let me shock the chit out of everybody, they should just extend Medicare to everyone, with some adjustments."--HB
damn liberal 
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Hellbender
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 3416
Loc: Taney County
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Quote:
And doctors will get a raise from $1000 a day to $1000 an hour. Every other cost connected with medicine would go 'way up too.
Is that why doctors don't like to take on Medicare patients?
D you happen to have a story based on reality, something that connects at the end. You say you had to put your poor mom in a home under Medicare, than you say everyone should be responsible for their own, then you tell us you're making a fortune on Exxon. I don't know whether you're up or down.
Whack notice I said that some adjustments might need to be made. All I'm saying is much the same as you, just make Medicare the starting point because there will be an agency, either new or old. Irregardless of what needs to be fixed in Medicare, they do have plans from Bare Minimum to none if you're covered privately.
Lib, Liberty, liberal, sell the forest, put money in treasury, mo money fo Libs to spend, drive Hondas, drink Starbucks, etc. Ring a bell? 
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A government survey has shown that 91% of illegal immigrants come to this country so that they can see their own doctor.
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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damn man with your extend Medicare to everyone we'd have the sell the forests and a couple of branches of the military just to pay that damn bill.
damn liberal
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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regardless, HB, irregardless ain't a word dude, regardless is though
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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get rid of Medicare and Medicaid, that's the beginning of the answer, right after we sell the forests  everything's better in a private setting
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Ozark
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 4012
Loc: out in the woods
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I got an old aunt and uncle, he's retired from a good government job and he retired with full medical coverage.
They're on Medicare and they've got the government insurance plus a private medical insurance policy on the side. Since they've got double or triple coverage, they MAKE money most every time they go to the doctor. So - between the two of them they go to the doctor at least twice a week and they've been pulling that for over 15 years.
There's nothing much wrong with them, they're just old. Those two people have had as much medical care as the entire population of a third-world country gets - it's their hobby.
There's no telling how much the medical industry has made off them, and there's no telling how much they've made health insurance premiums go up.
I've got a feeling there's a lot of people like that - using up medical resources because they don't have to pay for it. Health care providers are glad to go along with it because they've got insurance companies and the government to bill for a whole bunch of unnecessary services.
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Hellbender
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 3416
Loc: Taney County
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Main Entry: ir?re?gard?less
Pronunciation: "ir-i-'g?rd-l&s
Function: adverb
Etymology: probably blend of irrespective and regardless
nonstandard : REGARDLESS
usage Irregardless originated in dialectal American speech in the early 20th century. Its fairly widespread use in speech called it to the attention of usage commentators as early as 1927. The most frequently repeated remark about it is that "there is no such word." There is such a word , however. It is still used primarily in speech, although it can be found from time to time in edited prose.
Is fork, like in fork you, a word Lib?
Quote:
They're on Medicare and they've got the government insurance plus a private medical insurance policy on the side. Since they've got double or triple coverage, they MAKE money most every time they go to the doctor. So - between the two of them they go to the doctor at least twice a week and they've been pulling that for over 15 years.
Bullchit, we didn't fall off the Turnip truck yesterday. You need to study up on Medicare, and see how it really works 
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A government survey has shown that 91% of illegal immigrants come to this country so that they can see their own doctor.
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Ozark
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 4012
Loc: out in the woods
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Quote:
Hellbender said:
You need to study up on Medicare, and see how it really works
I know how Medicare works. I've been through years of it with my Mom.
I'm telling ya - for certain procedures and prescriptions they're submitting claims to two insurance companies and coming out ahead.
Anyway, the point is that when medical care is free people overuse it. The doctor's always glad to give you another pill - then another pill to counteract the side effects of that one, and another pill for the side effects of that one, etc., etc. Oops, we better run some more tests here.
Like any business's expensive equipment, whether it's a bulldozer, a printing press, or a MRI machine - you need to run it as much as possible to make it pay for itself. That's easy for the medical profession to do since the doctor gets to say what's needed and the government and insurance companies are paying.
Also, doctors are scared to death of malpractice suits. The way they protect themselves is to test and treat for everything imaginable, no matter how unlikely it is. If they undertest and undertreat, they might get sued - if they overtest and overtreat they make a bunch of extra money. Tough choice.
What do you think about those direct ads for prescription medications on TV now - where they're trying to get patients to ask their doctor to prescribe some drug? My son-in-law doctor says that's a real pain in the ass - lots of people see stuff on TV and ask for it. If it won't hurt them, he goes along with it - if they want it, he'll write the 'scrip to keep 'em happy.
Irregardless, I think we oughta run another diagnostic test or two.
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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irregardless should be avoided in favor of regardless, Oxford Dictionary
HB the use of ir and less in a word creates a double negative in reference to regard so what is it those who think it sounds better are trying to say?
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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But regardless, what a damn liberal, trumpeting the "success" of Medicare. Do I need to go over the stats in regard to Medicare since it was put in place?
Why you got to be so damn liberal, defending government ownership of vast swaths of land and now you defend Medicare
when are you voting for Hillary anyway, HB?
Barry Goldwater would be ashamed 
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Jaeger
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 2008
Loc: St. Louis
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You think health insurance costs allot now?
Wait till it's free!
This is nothing more than another in a long line of leftist scams to take your money and make your decisions for you.
This is not about insuring the uninsured. If you go to a hospital they will treat you no matter what.
Free does not mean free from responsibility. It means free to make your own decisions, even if they're poor ones. It means free to suffer, and free to define your own happiness. It does not mean that some polititian is free to decide what your future is going to be.
If this is "progress", keep it. Our society is going to hell because people have lost the concept of honor and shame. We are becomming a nation of lawyers, and it will most certainly be our undoing.
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"Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem." - President Ronald Reagan
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Ozark
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 4012
Loc: out in the woods
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"Irregardless" doesn't bother me much - I just avoid using it because "regardless" is the same thing.
The new TV newcaster words that do bother me (and you hear them all the time) are "horrendous" and "horrific".
Those are just made-up combinations of "horrible" with "tremendous" and "terrific". How ignorant.
Whenever you hear those words, it's Geraldo Rivera-type breathless sensational reporting - and I hate that crap.
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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actually Ozark horrific and horrendous are proper words
irregardless remains a double negative and does not mean the same thing as regardless, regardless is no regard, irregardless is no regardless, nonsensical term no doubt coined by someone trying to sound smarter than they really are.
but back to Medicare for everyone, what damn liberal turnip truck did HB fall off of in the first place?
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Hellbender
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 3416
Loc: Taney County
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Irregardless Medicare is composed of 2 parts, plus many, if not most opt for a supplement from a private insurer. The private insurers are a free market entity, so what do or charge is what the market will bear.
Ozark what did your mom have, A, A & B, no supplement, A & B & a supplement? It all makes a big difference.
As to medicare, once again the idea and the lay out would work well. I know the performance sucks, but how many of you knotheads think a new gubment agency will work better??
Double negative huh, is this  a double negative.
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A government survey has shown that 91% of illegal immigrants come to this country so that they can see their own doctor.
Edited by Hellbender (09/24/07 02:08 PM)
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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I am still trying to figure out who on here you are trying to argue with that favors government involvement. Where is this ghost that you see that no one else sees?
Please explain how it is you can argue something that has not been advocated here, and how is it again that you would expand a government failure such as medicare and call yourself a conservative, or better yet, how is expanding a known failure better than the thing everyone here is firmly against, a new bureaucracy that will prove itself a failure overnight?
Again, who the hell are you arguing with, who are the knotheads who are trumpeting the greatness of government?
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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how about an amendment to the Constitution that requires government programs be solvent?
That'd just scare the hell out of everyone wouldn't it, having to actually have the cash on hand to do what they promise.
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Ozark
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 4012
Loc: out in the woods
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Quote:
Hellbender said:
Ozark what did your mom have, A, A & B, no supplement, A & B & a supplement?
She had Part A Medicare, no Part B, and supplemental health insurance through G.E.H.A. (my Dad was a retired mail carrier).
'Way back when my folks turned 65 in CA, they had Kaiser Insurance. It was a GREAT deal with low premiums - all Dr. visits cost them $5 and all prescriptions cost $3. It's not that way anymore, of course. Because they had such good insurance at the time, they didn't get Part B Medicare.
But things changed. When you turn 65, be sure and get on Part B. When my Mom went into a nursing home at age 92 she needed it - and the only way to get her on it would have been to pay 27 years of retroactive monthly premiums. That's not a good option.
My folks didn't anticipate that medical costs and premiums would go up so much, of course - and neither did I. When I retired, our health insurance premiums had always been a couple of hundred bucks a month, no big deal. I figured they'd go up some as we got older, but I didn't know they'd go up 500% or 600% - and I think that's putting a lot of folks in a bind.
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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whatever happened to here's your bill, pay it
I don't care how many damn parts Medicare has, damn chit don't work and all it has done is increase healthcare costs in this country by several thousand percent since its inception in the 60s.
Thank you LBJ
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