Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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Tonto why don't you tend to Silver
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!
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Vogi
member
Reged: 12/15/05
Posts: 1756
Loc: Saline County, MO
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Corns up today, ethanols even, and the check showed up yesterday. I'd say it's been a good week. Time to help ol' foots some more....
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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The gubbamint robs Peter to pay Vogi, I mean Paul
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Vogi
member
Reged: 12/15/05
Posts: 1756
Loc: Saline County, MO
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You bet it does, and you can go see on the web just how much they have paid me. And then I can show you how we just pass it on to the chemical, seed and other supplies of our inputs. If you think for a minute that money stays were it is paid intially, you are dead wrong. I ain't nothin' more than a middle man to pass the money along. And everybody knows it but Washington. Check out the relationship between farm subsidies and input costs and you'll see what I mean.
Looks like the China man forgot to raise much of a crop this year, so it looks like the grains may trend up some more. During harvest time at that!
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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the question remains why you can't make it without government help
you produce food, it's kind of needed by everyone on the planet and you can't figure out a way to make a profit off of it without getting advanced from the government
that's pathetic
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JJ McGuire
Reged: 06/01/06
Posts: 357
Loc: Chester Springs, PA
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What is the difference between a tax break and a subsidy?
Aside that one is usually given by state or nation in which part of the taxes that would normally be collected from an organization are instead foregone in order to encourage the production or purchase of a good and the other is a type of financial government assistance in order to encourage the production or purchase of a good?
Oh and one is associated with a farm and the other with a company?
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keeping it rural
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Vogi
member
Reged: 12/15/05
Posts: 1756
Loc: Saline County, MO
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Quote:
Liberty said:
the question remains why you can't make it without government help
you produce food, it's kind of needed by everyone on the planet and you can't figure out a way to make a profit off of it without getting advanced from the government
that's pathetic
This is your take and what you say. I never said I don't make a profit without the gov money, we do just fine thank you. Your statement is an assumption you made in your factless arguement, and your assumptions are what are pathetic.
All the gov check does is make me pay a larger tax bill each year. And you can take some comfort is knowing that between the state and feds, I give half of it back.  
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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"What is the difference between a tax break and a subsidy?"--JJ
your question assumes that all the money is the government's
a tax cut assures you keep more of your own money
a tax break is a government meddling in your business, bribing you to do something you wouldn't do otherwise, pretty damn unAmerican if you ask me
a subsidy takes your money and gives it to Vogi because your government decided he is more important than you are
the government tells the nation what is important rather than the people of the nation telling the government what is important
A Nanny state with nipples for everyone provided what they do is acceptable to the government
did you forget you are free JJ?
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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"This is your take and what you say. I never said I don't make a profit without the gov money, we do just fine thank you. Your statement is an assumption you made in your factless arguement, and your assumptions are what are pathetic.
All the gov check does is make me pay a larger tax bill each year. And you can take some comfort is knowing that between the state and feds, I give half of it back."--Vogi
so you admit to not needing a government check yet you accept it anyway, that's even more pathetic
I take no comfort in the government robbing people of their money each year
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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I love all you so-called conservatives coming out of the woodwork and defending subsidies
this is classic, y'all might as well vote for Hillary
every damn one of you
the difference between the argument you guys are stating and the one the socialists are stating is only differentiated by nuance.
We are a capitalist society, in case you all have forgotten, we don't need government subsidies
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Vogi
member
Reged: 12/15/05
Posts: 1756
Loc: Saline County, MO
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Quote:
Liberty said:
...takes your money and gives it to Vogi because your government decided he is more important than you are...
And don't you forget it! 
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Vogi
member
Reged: 12/15/05
Posts: 1756
Loc: Saline County, MO
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Quote:
Liberty said:
so you admit to not needing a government check yet you accept it anyway, that's even more pathetic
Call it what you want, all I know is the man says "I'm from the government, and I'm here to help you."
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Vogi
member
Reged: 12/15/05
Posts: 1756
Loc: Saline County, MO
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Quote:
Liberty said:
I love all you so-called conservatives coming out of the woodwork and defending subsidies
When did I ever say I was a conservative?
Step away from the pitcher dude... 
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Hellbender
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 3416
Loc: Taney County
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Quote:
you produce food, it's kind of needed by everyone on the planet and you can't figure out a way to make a profit off of it without getting advanced from the government
Rosie if you could somehow manage to pull your head out and think in something other than simplistic terms, you would understand a lot of concepts.
Lets see, in Rosie Dorkweed's world we wouldn't have any government intervention in Flu shots, if we were to have a major outbreak, we would just happily suffer the consequences. We would only have a military when we needed one, if they were untrained and short of personnel, we would just accept the consequences. If farmers have a bad year and have no guarantee of solvency, they just plant a lot less, and if more crops than usual fail for unseen reasons, we can just accept the consequences of food shortages.
Rosie, you're not a conservative, you're an anarchist with a governing philosophy that predates caveman, who obviously was more socially advanced than you.
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A government survey has shown that 91% of illegal immigrants come to this country so that they can see their own doctor.
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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No, I just have faith in individuals and I don't fall for fear politics
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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"government intervention in Flu shots"--HB
you want a shortage ask the government to administer it
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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"If farmers have a bad year and have no guarantee of solvency, they just plant a lot less, and if more crops than usual fail for unseen reasons, we can just accept the consequences of food shortages."--HB
Why? How much of the damn stuff do we export anyway if there's going to be a shortage it won't be here
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Hellbender
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 3416
Loc: Taney County
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Quote:
Why? How much of the damn stuff do we export anyway if there's going to be a shortage it won't be here
Well if you don't know how much we export, maybe you should give up your job as expert forester, leave the woods and move to the farm, and become an expert farmer.
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A government survey has shown that 91% of illegal immigrants come to this country so that they can see their own doctor.
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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I always love it when I know you got the point and you have nothing to say, you've had one true statement over the past six months, in fact you can't debate
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Hellbender
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 3416
Loc: Taney County
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Quote:
I just have faith in individuals and I don't fall for fear politics
In this country individuals are suppose to shape politics, but unfortunately in our haste to enjoy the fruits of our democracy, we forgot to keep our eye on our representatives. That has little to do with what should be, nor that changes need to be made, we have to get back to where we should be to evaluate anything.
The concept that we don't need anything from a common effort is too ignorant to even consider.
A true conservative wants minimal government, but not to the point that we lose all the benefits of common efforts where its beneficial. They believe history is an important reminder and that you don't solve problems that don't yet exist. The most important thing that conservatives believe in is covering your ass, such as making sure are food supply is protected.
Your idea of government is being tested today, in Somalia.
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A government survey has shown that 91% of illegal immigrants come to this country so that they can see their own doctor.
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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"The concept that we don't need anything from a common effort is too ignorant to even consider."--Hellbender
yeah we need a common defense, roads, administration of justice and very little else
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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"A true conservative wants minimal government, but not to the point that we lose all the benefits of common efforts where its beneficial. They believe history is an important reminder and that you don't solve problems that don't yet exist."--Helliberal
we don't need national forests
we don't need national healthcare
we don't need a complicated tax system that punishes achievement, ownership and the fact that we all die
we don't need the government controlling agriculture
we don't need the government controlling land use
we don't need the government interfering with our lives to the level they currently do and any subtraction from this level is a move in the right direction (pun intended)
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Liberty
member
Reged: 12/14/05
Posts: 5796
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We don't need an FDA
We don't need a Department of Education
We don't need a Department of Commerce
We don't need a Department of Agriculture
We don't need a Department of the Interior
We don't need a Department of Housing and Urban Development
We don't need a Department of Homeland Security (we already had one)
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