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HAUS
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Camera suggestions
      #263899 - 01/07/23 09:51 AM

Hey Mr. Wu (and others),

I've been doing my homework and wanted input from those who have run on the dslr cameras for awhile (and do quality work with their photography).

I'm not going to drop the money on a mirrorless camera, so I was wondering what folks are using for dslr and what brands/models they like..

I'm looking for something to shoot mostly distant landscape shots and i've been reading/looking at the Canon T6i, T7i and comparable models to those cameras. I know these models probably aren't ideal, but they'll be good enough unless I want to blow them up to cover the house with them..

What brands and models are you using and why do you like them?



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67Firebird
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: HAUS]
      #263901 - 01/07/23 09:07 PM

I don't know much, and my best-ever camera is my Nikon D3200. I bought it years ago, when it was an old model being sold on clearance.

Here's a discussion, by some people who apparently do know.

https://www.ar15.com/forums/general/Wher...ice-/5-2611872/


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wuchangAdministrator
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: HAUS]
      #263904 - 01/08/23 12:41 PM

Quote:

HAUS said:
Hey Mr. Wu (and others),

I've been doing my homework and wanted input from those who have run on the dslr cameras for awhile (and do quality work with their photography).

I'm not going to drop the money on a mirrorless camera, so I was wondering what folks are using for dslr and what brands/models they like..

I'm looking for something to shoot mostly distant landscape shots and i've been reading/looking at the Canon T6i, T7i and comparable models to those cameras. I know these models probably aren't ideal, but they'll be good enough unless I want to blow them up to cover the house with them..

What brands and models are you using and why do you like them?






Haus---- this gonna be a LONG one

One of the great things about today's entry level cameras.....regardless of manufacturer,is they are going to do a pretty good job. The camera Kurt mentioned is a very good entry level camera.....nothing wrong with it....even if it is a 'darkside' camera LOL.

So, you say it will be primarily used for landscape photos. Ok,that type of photography has certain characteristics.

As a rule, you don't need a lot of frames per second since landscapes don't run around a lot....like birds, animals and kid sports.

If you take a great landscape of say a mountain in Montana and decide you want to have the image enlarged and printed to hang on the wall.....you probably want a good number of megapixels (resolution) so it will have a good amount of detail visible at normal viewing distance.

Since the best light to photograph that Montana Mountain will be a bit before sunrise and maybe an hour or so after, you want a camera that doesn't generate digital "noise" and has good ergonomics/menu system so you can set up with a flashlight or headlight and not have too much trouble doing it.

The T7i will do all these things. You might get a bit more "noise" due to its crop sensor but there are ways to work around it.

The 24 mps will let you print big if you need to. Molly shoots a 10mps Canon 40D and it will easily enlarge even bigger than the 20x30 inch covered bridge image I am looking at right now.

I don't know if your 'homework' led you to the Patron Saint of Landscape Photographers, Ansel Adams, but he packed a rig that had to weigh a ton up some of the larger mountains---- he might have wanted more resolution.....but I an sure he would have loved a lot lighter rig to tote into the wilderness.


That brings us back to the beginning--what camera.

I like Canon.....I like its menu system and its ergonomics.

Nikon isn't bad but I found its menus a bit more complicated and it didn't feel as good to me in the hand.

Sony? Lord help you. I realize that today's cameras are probably smarter than me but I would have to have an owner's manual and the number for the help line until I could figure it out.

All things considered....whatever you buy, you learn to work the camera as you go along. Some of the newer photogs look at me strange when I tell them stop down 2/3's of a stop. Todays, cameras do a lot of that stuff for you regardless of brand name, so don't sweat it.

When you buy your camera of choice, carry it every where for the first 3 to 6 months and shoot anything that catches your eye. It is digital.....the delete button doesn't cost you anything so fire away and learn from your mistakes.


Extra gear

Card reader--- lets you transfer your photos to your computer. Most common memory cards will be CF and SD. Most card readers will have slots for each. Some cameras will only take SD and others CF.

Post processing programs-- yep, you will need to have some program to crop and do other things to your images. Most photogs use Lightroom by Adobe---plenty of books on it--I would suggest a class if you can find one where you are at. YouTube has a ton of tutorials.

Photoshop Elements-- has a lot presets that you just click and go....not bad to learn on and you can probably find it on sale-- it comes with a rudimentary video editor as well...or at least I thihk it does.

Phot0shop---steep learning curve and for most photographers it might be overkill.....but I learned on it and prefer it to anything else out there......but I hate Adobe LOL

Adobe has a monthly fee program that lets you 'rent' both Lightroom and Photoshop for $19.99

Lots of free programs as well---Google free photo processing programs. Irfanview is a pretty good one


remote trigger cable--- eventually you will probably buy one. What it does is let you take a picture without touching the camera---- yeah, I know you think you are steady handed but you might be shooting at slow shutter speeds and find out that you aren't.
You can wait to buy this until you are sure you are going to stay with the hobby. Most cameras have a delay setting that lets you set up and then press the shutter button and get away from the camera and then it goes off after a pre-determined time.(Usually 2 or 10 seconds)

Tripod-- you will eventually need to buy one Aluminum is less expensive but heavier than Carbon Fiber. Depends on how much and how far you are going to lug it. I prefer Carbon Fiber and twist locks rather than clip locks-- you will see what I'm talking about when you do your research when it is time to buy.

Ball head-- you will find out everything you need to know when you research it

Arca/Swiss locking plate will go on the ball head.

Remember---cheap is ok but there is a reason why the best costs what it does in ease of use and fit/finish

I think everything is over priced but there is nothing more frustrating than a ballhead or plate or whatever that won't stay locked and almost drops your camera and lens on the ground etc.

Last---

Shoot your beginners rig for a year before you go buy really good glass. That will give you time to learn how to set up the camera and how it shoots etc before you decide if you want better glass.

Settings-- old saying for landscape photogs--F8 and be there
make sure your landscapes are in focus from foreground to back ground (F8 -F16 will see to part of that) and it is always nice to have something in the foreground---and having people at a distance sometimes help establish scale.....otherwise wait until everyone has left or get there before anyone can mess you up.

Like I said--YouTube and your library are your friend----and if I can help ya-- let me know

I like Canon and Canon lens but Sigma makes some very fine lens and they are cheaper (to answer your unasked question....no I don't have an Sigma lens but I have shot with them.)

Mirrorless makes a lot of things easier ....exposure for one and the new autofocus is fantastic--- however, you may get on a manual focus kick like a lot of landscape guys do and once you learn manual exposure..... well, take your time and shoot in Aperture until you do.


My favorite Canon landscape dslr--- 5DsR 50mps-- used it in South Dakota on bison and other things--almost bought one but it only shot 5 frames a second and 50mp files requires some serious thought about computer power or upgrade

Molly's favorite lens is a 10-22 which on a camera like the T7i equals 16-35 in full frame-- super wide and very sharp for a crop sensor lens
Also crop sensor camera wedding photogs use it quite a lot and Molly could make a living doing weddings with it but sooner or later she would punch some Bridezilla or Bridezilla's momma and that would the end of that LOL


If you make it this far--- then I guess you have been bit by the bug enough to hang in there LOL


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wuchangAdministrator
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: wuchang]
      #263905 - 01/08/23 01:09 PM

One more thing

you can rent a camera and lens at

https://www.lensrentals.com/

I have used them for years ….easy peasy

I would rent a camera or a lense and use it before buying,that way when I did buy, I knew what I was buying

Before I could afford some gear, I would rent when I needed it……Molly would batten down the hatches if I said I liked a lens……..she knew it would be bought sooner than later


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HAUS
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: wuchang]
      #263906 - 01/09/23 02:50 PM

truckloads of awesomeness!! and yes, i made it to the end and will re-read this multiple times..

bridezilla --

people.. what can i say? that's why i enjoy shooting out in the middle of nowhere, so bridezilla makes perfect sense

i think that's pretty awesome that Molly has used a 10mp camera. I've used a pocket Kodak camera my parents bought me eons ago and i think it was 10 mp, and on the pc, it had some amazing clarity and crispness for what it was (I'll have to look up the model)

I had inquired about a T6i this last week but didn't get much feedback from the owner, so I dropped the conversation, so I thoroughly appreciate the info on renting. I wasn't aware of that and that's ideal cause I go overboard on researching chit to the point of pissing myself off before I buy something..

Ansel Adams... I've got a calendar of his hanging in the kitchen. Loved his photos when I was a pre-teen and had my parents buy me a book back in the 80's that went into insane details of his methods. It was like a science book, but had the answers to everything for film cameras back then in regards to shooting outside.

Thank you again for the information (You too Kurt) and I'll keep you updated.
Danke schoen



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67Firebird
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: HAUS]
      #263907 - 01/09/23 07:28 PM



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HAUS
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: 67Firebird]
      #263908 - 01/10/23 02:03 PM

My little pocket camera is a Kodak Z915 and it's taken some pretty cool photos over the years. Here's a few:







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wuchangAdministrator
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: HAUS]
      #263909 - 01/10/23 05:50 PM

Those are really pretty good
The last one and first one are my picks

A little post processing and you are in the money


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HAUS
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: wuchang]
      #263918 - 01/16/23 05:22 PM

thank you sir.

quick question: if i eventually want to get a full frame camera (canon most likely) i probably shouldn't spend money on lenses for a crop sensor camera, correct?

i imagine a full frame lens would work on a smaller sensor, but not the other way around.

thank you.



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wuchangAdministrator
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: HAUS]
      #263919 - 01/17/23 07:20 AM

You usually CAN use a full frame lens on a crop body but a crop sensor lens will not work on the full frame

Example
Molly shoots a 40 D (crop sensor body) and uses a full body 500mm,or a 100-400 but her 10-22 (crop lens) will not work on my 1D (full frame)

Her 10-22 is the equivalent of a full frame 16-35 (1.6 crop factor x 10mm= 16mm and 1.6 x 22=35mm)

The 16-35 on her camera gives the following field of view
1.6 x 16=26mm and 1.6 x 35 = 56mm

Wide angle is usually defined as 28mm or smaller

So using the 16-35 barely qualifies as wide angle if used on a crop camera.

This article does a decent job explaining it
https://yourphotoadvisor.com/full-frame-lens-on-crop-sensor-this-is-what-happens/

There are always people that trade in perfectly good used cameras to buy the latest and greatest which means you can pick up an older model for reasonable money.
Considering most digital cameras are rated for 100,000 or more on a shutter, they have a pretty long life.

Something to think about
I have bought several used camera bodies but have always bought my lens new


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HAUS
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: wuchang]
      #263920 - 01/17/23 01:45 PM

thank you sir! i really appreciate all of this.

i've got a couple messages going with some fairly local folks (hour away).

one fella is selling a 5d mark iv body (which is more camera than i'd need) for $900 ($1600 for a tamron 24-70mm f2.8 included)
and then another guy is selling a 5d mark ii and a 5d mark iii,
EF 24-105 1.4,
EF 50mm 1.4,
Cam Ranger,
20' tether,
spider camera holder + grips,
128gb flash
64gb (x4) flash
16gb (x4) flash
(2) compact flash readers
(2) batteries and a charger for $1500.

good grief!, i don't know what most of that stuff is, but it looks impressive sitting on his table..

i didn't realize how much lenses cost. i'd been focused on cameras so when i started looking at lenses, i bout chit.. No wonder Miss Molly runs a tight ship

i reckon these cameras listed above are overkill for my current level of experience, similar to buying a 1-ton diesel to pull a pop-up camper..



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hucklburry
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: HAUS]
      #263921 - 01/18/23 08:13 AM

My wife is semi-pro, I've helped finance, like every birfday and Christmas etc. She got a 150-600 tamaron to play with this past holiday season...but has a few nice canon lenses as well.

I like to compare local used prices to ebay, like the mark III above is roughly $400 all day, and the mark IV averages to like $900 on ebay.

What is your budget? Its easy to spend $4k on one body and one lense.


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wuchangAdministrator
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: hucklburry]
      #263922 - 01/18/23 07:07 PM

Haus.

While the cameras you noted have some extras over an entry level like resolution,better dynamic range etc, they still operate like that entry camera when you get down to the nitty gritty.

All those cameras you mentioned are very good cameras…….I wouldn’t turn my nose up at any of them.

If you want a great travel/walk around lens,that 24-105 is the ticket. I used it in South Dakota and it did great…….if I was into travel/photo journalism/street photography…..I’d have one.

The current mirrorless cameras have put used dslr’s into a buyer’s market. You can get a lot of camera for reasonable prices.


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HAUS
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: wuchang]
      #263925 - 01/19/23 07:53 AM

huck,

really didn't have a budget, but after looking, i'll probably stay under a grand to get going. reading some of the numbers stuff, regarding lenses, makes me feel like the lady fixin to pay 3k for a chrome muffler bearing replacement..

Mr. WU,
Thank you for the wisdom again. I had determined to just stay pretty simple and you confirmed it. I look at the pictures I've taken on the pocket camera and realize I don't need the cadillac right out of the gate. I'm itching to get something though, especially during winter. (no humidity clouding up the horizons)

Thank you sirs!

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wuchangAdministrator
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: HAUS]
      #263926 - 01/19/23 12:57 PM

Tips on Landscape photography


https://digital-photography-school.com/1...y@sbcglobal.net


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wuchangAdministrator
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: wuchang]
      #263928 - 01/19/23 01:21 PM

Haus

I have seen several people get enamored about photography,buy some expensive gear….talking pro level stuff and then 6 months lose interest and then they are sellers at a fraction of the value.

I shot an advanced point and shoot for months….learned a ton shooting it….and learned that I needed better equipment if I was going to get the photos I could see in my head.

Bought a one step under the best camera and a very good lens……was sick about what I paid for it but it was the first step of what has been a really good way for me to look at the world and indulge my waterfowl obessession and expand it to a lot of other things as well.

Still have that camera and lens……Molly uses the lens and won’t let me sell it to get the new improved version LOL
Then it was a pro level 500….pro level camera …600….another pro level camera…..and if the economy wasn’t so crazy, I would be in the market for a R camera……the autofocus is so good, people can get results it took me years to obtain. Amazing equipment……but right now $$$$ is staying in the bank.

No regrets even if my retirement funds took a hit LOL

You will know when it is time to upgrade or not……….


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HAUS
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: wuchang]
      #263929 - 01/19/23 02:46 PM

I'm online right now reading that article you linked to and now reading thru websites on figuring lens sizes based on sensor size..

My pocket camera has manual settings and years ago, I did a little google searching and figured out what I needed to do to take a nighttime photo of the house with an open shutter, (forgot all of that information already), so I setup a tripod from an old telescope and took a few photos over the span of a couple of weeks. They were okay and nothing spectacular, but it was fun to see the camera do more than what the pre-set settings allowed it to do and it was fulfilling to apply some knowledge and see it actually work in person.

I currently own a business that I opened without any prior professional experience in and it's fairly successful. I brew beer for a living and most folks have no idea the amount of detail, mathematics and science that's involved in a batch of beer and that's fine, but i've gotten loads of questions over the years from people getting into brewing and asking questions about certain things in the process and the answer is usually way over their head, because I don't want to give them half the information..

I'm slowly learning this photography stuff is very similar. It takes some studying to get the numbers down for specific things, if you want to do it correctly, and I feel like some of those folks early-on in the brewing hobby, asking about stuff that takes years of experience to learn OR boatloads of research and comprehension.

Anyway, we're in the process of selling the business, so I'm thoroughly excited to have a little more free time and freedom and this picture taking has kinda gnawed at me since I was young. I've still got my parent old Pentax 35mm film camera, as I kind of hijacked it from them at some point many years ago.
For whatever reason, maybe cause I'm outdoors and always looking around, it seems like taking a nice sunrise or sunset photo, or some nature photo has come easy to me, and since I enjoy it, I guess I should pursue it and see where it goes.

I've been brewing beer to try and enhance and brighten people's days, I find taking awesome photos for folks to enjoy even more rewarding.

I'm prolly going to go the safe route (less money) and go from there, but, after reading your reply, I think I'm going to get familiar again with that lil pocket camera first. Sucker is paid for and I can re-learn some of this stuff on it.
I know the sick feeling you mentioned. I've put myself in that spot multiple times recently

I sure appreciate the info, opinions and wisdom! This is fun to talk about.



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wuchangAdministrator
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: HAUS]
      #263930 - 01/20/23 07:43 AM

Haus

Here is the contradiction

Yeah, your current gear will produce good results but someday you are going to take the plunge and buy some super high megapixel camera that requires a super stable tripod……..and you will get up at some ungodly hour to hike into a place that caught your eye to catch the first light.

Then the next thing you know, you will painstakingly work on a computer that can handle that big honking mega file. You will learn to dodge and burn and all sorts of processing tricks.

Then if you are really ate up with it…..you will be printing those files…..either yourself or through a photo lab. You will learn to mat and frame them.

Next thing you know, you will be showing them off…on-line or in photo contests or even in a gallery……might even sell a few…….but at the end of the day…….you do it for you and there ain’t nothing wrong with that

Have fun


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HAUS
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: wuchang]
      #263931 - 01/20/23 09:04 AM

Thank you sir!

That was pretty awesome.

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wuchangAdministrator
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: HAUS]
      #263932 - 01/20/23 04:56 PM

Of course you can take the money for a big dog kit and instead spend on a trip LOL

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HAUS
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: wuchang]
      #263940 - 01/25/23 10:08 AM

trips are dangerous for me. i usually end up wanting to move there if i really like it..


i just pulled the trigger on a used EOS 6D with a 24-105 lens.

hopefully it's all in good shape

Thanks again. I'll keep you updated.



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wuchangAdministrator
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: HAUS]
      #263945 - 01/25/23 05:17 PM

Quote:

HAUS said:
trips are dangerous for me. i usually end up wanting to move there if i really like it..


i just pulled the trigger on a used EOS 6D with a 24-105 lens.

hopefully it's all in good shape

Thanks again. I'll keep you updated.






Yeah, I know that dealio about moving……got 2 places on the short list and each is at least a 15 hr drive…….only one of the in-laws has enough gas money to come visit so in someways that is a plus

That is a very very nice rig you picked…….hope it does what you want


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HAUS
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: wuchang]
      #263948 - 01/27/23 09:53 AM

i have been combing youtube and came across a couple videos of folks talking about KEH for buying used gear, so i checked em out and found the rig i purchased.

a bit of a risk, but i bought a "bargain" rated body and "ugly" rated lens, but they'll let you send it back for free within 21 days and both are warrantied for 180 days, so I'll see how "bad they are when they arrive.
From the handful of videos I had watched, the people who ordered "ugly" said their equipment was in fantastic condition, aside from normal wear, so i thought it was worth it on this first go-round.

i got the camera, battery, charger and lens for under $600 (free shipping too). Supposed to arrive today already so I'll see what the shutter count is and report back on the condition of everything.



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wuchangAdministrator
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: HAUS]
      #263949 - 01/27/23 11:21 PM

Bought one of Molly’s cameras from KEH……It was in great condition

You must have watched one of Tony And Chelsea Northrup’s challenge videos…….they are sponsored by KEH but KEH is a good company. Have several friends that have bought from them with no problems……but they didn’t buy “ugly” LOL

I will be interested to see how your rig comes in.


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HAUS
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Re: Camera suggestions [Re: wuchang]
      #263950 - 02/01/23 08:55 AM

Yes sir, I believe that was the couple I saw on YT buying the bargain models. I have to admit, I'm impressed with what I received. The camera has just a small bit of wear on the bottom of the camera, but it's not dirty or have crap imbedded in the cracks and crevices.
The lens was an "ugly" designation and it does have a pretty decent gouge in the outer glass. (Not sure if that affects the image?)
Overall, everything looks broken-in, like a good ball glove or pair of hunting boots, but not abused. That's what I like.

Wu, what are your thoughts on the lens? Will it be okay, or should I send it back?










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